Horn Matters | A French Horn and Brass Site and Resource | John Ericson and Bruce Hembd

In the past month I have had the luxury of visits to my studio by two excellent horn makers (Atkinson and Patterson) and a lengthy E-mail conversation with yet another (Medlin). Those experiences have pointed out to me even more the black art of making Geyer (and Knopf) style horns.

Black art? It really seems like some kind of magic to experience how apparently small differences of design will make huge differences in how you perceive the playing quality and sound of an instrument. The high Bb is well known as a note to test on Geyer style horns (more here), but there are a lot of other differences obvious ranging from subtle things like perception of “clicks” (more here) to much more audible differences.

For example, production horns don’t tend to have long soldered connections between tubes of the length seen in this photo. Note there is no brace between the tube next to the bell and the bell, with a long soldered connection barely visible (and much easier to see in reality than in a photo). All the custom makers I have had contact with recently make use of this type of connection to varying degrees, which makes for a more connected, solid instrument, but requires more skillful construction and potentially more involved cleanup in soldering. Production horns for those reasons tend to have most or even all connections done with braces.

Speaking of braces, that is another variable and it is hugely eye opening to compare the bracing on several otherwise similar horns. Brace placement is done very intentionally in the hands of a fine maker and certainly impacts how a horn plays. There are choices to be made that are based on often years of slight variations and experimentation. From the perspective of the horn buyer you will see that some makers leave out braces that other horns have, others use styles of brace that are different than others in the same general locations, etc. It is not haphazardly done in any way, it is actually another very critical element of how a horn plays.

Some other major differences between horns I was able to briefly try included visible things such as reduction of the number of joints (especially by Atkinson with their new valve section, but also through the use of long pieces of tubing as well) on down to less visible things such as hollow valves (Atkinson again, which made a rather substantial difference) and of course subtle differences of the taper of the conical sections of the horn. As another example, I believe that you can perceive differences in sound and playing qualities between horns that, while otherwise identical, have brass or have nickel silver slide tubes.

The most eye opening differences I experienced when trying these horns recently related to a pair of otherwise identical Patterson horns, their Geyer and Knopf pattern horns. Most would consider them to be very similar designs, which they are (more here). The horns he had were made with exactly the same tapers and materials, and it was extremely interesting how different they felt and sounded. The only physical differences were the slightly different wrap and brace placements, yet those differences were easily felt and heard. It was not like one was actually better either, but clearly they were different horns — even though from the shop of the same maker and made with the same materials and tapers. But with that being said, I want to emphasize again that both instruments were fine instruments; the differences will mainly make them “speak” to different buyers who are coming at their testing of the instruments from different perspectives.

There are many fine horn makers out there, try all the horns you can and take a look at the small differences you can observe between different horns of outwardly the same model. It is an interesting study and part of what makes a great horn stand out to you from one that is not set up as ideally for your way of playing the horn.

And to close, thank you again to Atkinson and Patterson for stopping by with your horns, and I hope to develop the conversation with Medlin into an interview article in the near future.

One question raised fairly often is on the topic of what new horns can be purchased for roughly $7,000? Underlying the question is the fact that so many of the horns that really have advanced players interested are in the $9,000 plus range, and horns that sell for less than $5,000 are not what advanced students, good amateurs, and pros are looking for.

What the horn shopper hopes for in the new $7,000 horn is one that has much of the feel and sound of a “custom” or high end professional horn but without quite the big dent in the wallet — with an additional point being the buyer is in fact wanting a new horn, not a used horn, of which there are many to be found in roughly this same price range.

This article will focus on the horn market in the USA (the horns below can all be purchased from dealers in the USA) in the general retail price range (2016) of $6,000-8,000. The below are listed alphabetically by maker and organized by general type of horn wrap.

A brief word about prices

In the big picture all advertised prices, depending on the dealer, are probably negotiable. The article that follows presents no prices, merely noting where the horns discussed generally fit into our target $6,000 to $8,000 retail price range. Contact dealers for quotes. The reasons why they fit in the price range are all in general the same, having to do with some combination of the quality of parts (especially the valves and bell) and overall construction relative to that seen in the typical student model horn.

As links and prices change over time, you will need to search to check availability and prices.

Geyer/Knopf wrap horns

The higher end horn market in recent years has clearly trended in the USA toward horns with a Geyer/Knopf type wrap (more in general on these horn types here), or some closely related wrap that would be perceived, at least at a distance, to be of the same general type. Descriptions tend to call them Geyer style horns, probably due to Geyer being long out of business but Knopf still sells horns.

Briz

First up alphabetically is the Pope Balu Alliance horn, which is a Knopf style horn made in China by Briz. This is their top of line model and features a hand hammered bell tail and first branch. Priced at the lower end of our price range, only about ten of these are made a year at this time.

Finke

German horn maker Finke has for many years produced a large line of horns. The models to note here are their numbers 68 and 69, also known as the Americus and Brendon models, which are upper end of this price range and are what could be described as modified Knopf wrap horns.

Willson

Probably best known in the USA for Euphoniums and tubas, Swiss maker Willson also makes a line of horns that price out at lower end of this price range. The CS250 series horn, while they describe it as a Geyer style horn, is a classic Knopf wrap instrument. [Disclaimer: I actually bought one of these (but subsequently upgraded into a higher price range), which is part of why this whole topic of the $7,000 horn resonates with me, and why I expect we will see more fine horns in this price range in coming years.]

Yamaha

This is probably the biggest news, as earlier this year it was announced (more here) that Yamaha is discontinuing the 667 horn (Knopf wrap) in favor of the new 671/871 models. A true Geyer style horn, the 871 will end up priced at retail around the middle of our price range. This joins another horn in the Yamaha catalog that is also in this price range, the YHR-667V horn, which prices out toward the top of the range. It would be considered a modified Knopf style horn.

Kruspe and modified Kruspe wrap horns

In common use today the term “Kruspe wrap” refers to any horn made to the same design layout as the Conn 8D (which was based on a Kruspe design — more on the topic of Kruspe or Geyer here), and we use here the term “modified Kruspe” to reference the same general design but with the separate Bb horn tuning slide (such as seen on a Holton Farkas model).

Conn

The Vintage 8D (V8D) model is the top of the line from Conn and prices out in the lower end of our target price range. One advertised feature is “custom stress free assembly,” which is a clue as to why this is priced where it is rather than with the standard 8D models — and also a general clue as to what is driving the price higher on all the horns in this article.

Holton

Holton is part of Conn-Selmer as well, and also has a top of the line model available, the H105. This horn is a modified Kruspe type with a special bronze bell, and prices out in the middle of this price range.

Hoyer

German maker Hoyer has a large line of horns that are available widely in the USA. Two of their Kruspe style horns price out at the upper end of our target price range, their 7801 and 7802 models.

Willson

Joining their Geyer/Knopf wrap horn (described earlier) in this price range are three more models that all price out at lower end of the spectrum. The CS240 is a modified Kruspe wrap and the CS260 and CS263 are both Kruspe style horns.

“Other” wrap horns

At least one more horn is out there in this price range that is not a Geyer or a Kruspe (for a bit more info on this general topic see here).

Hoyer

The Hoyer C-12 double horn has much of the look of a triple horn at a glance – the design is clearly related to their triple horn models — and is at the upper end of this price range.

To close…

The big news in this price range for 2016 is certainly the Yamaha 871, it puts a major maker right there with a product that is going to get a lot of serious looks. But don’t overlook the other models in the range, they are all there for distinct reasons related to the cost of manufacture and quality of parts, and are yet another reason to go to a good horn workshop to try some new horns! For more on trying horns in general see this article.

I have been working on final editing of a series of new Bordogni publications (more soon!) and have been playing as a result a lot of slurs and legato. Also, coming off the period instrument recital recently performed, I am looking at my modern horns with fresh eyes so to speak, and the topic of “clicks” came to mind.

So what are clicks?

I don’t believe this topic has been addressed directly in any horn publication actually. I first heard of noted the term used this way by Gunther Schuller when he gave a master class here at ASU in 2004 (more here). I wrote about it at the time,

…“clicks” (his term–I would say “bumps”) in slurs are harder to remove. To a point they can be the result of valve changes but even without valve changes they are hard to not have. Blowing through the notes helps but even on a horn with leaky valves and a very deep mouthpiece I find that clicks are more or less inevitable. On a modern horn with an efficient mouthpiece it is very hard to not have clicks, especially if you are listening closely for them.

What is interesting is I can certainly tell a difference between different horns in terms of clicks (disruption of the airstream) and valve changes in slurs. One of my horns in particular, it is the best by far and my assumption is it has to do with the way the valves were made, that the valve section of that horn is the best. It is a joy to play on the Bordogni editing compared to for example the 19th century style F horn I used on the recital, that valve section clicks much more in valve changes. One might guess a leaky valve section would be the least “clicky” in the valve changes, but of those available to me the best horn in fact has very tight valves, they are not at all leaky or old.

Of course you can rate horns many ways but with the topic briefly explained I just throw it out to the horn world. Give it a try; it is something you can feel easily if you focus in on it as part of AB testing of multiple horns.

UPDATE: For more on the topic, including a brief look at the underlying cause of clicks, see this recently (2016) updated article in the Hornmasters series:

• Hornmasters: Yancich and Fox on the Slur, Air, and Vowels